STAFF: The following is an unrehearsed interview with Iowa Senator Chuck Grassley, speaking to you live from Washington. Participating in today's public affairs program are Darin Svenson with KDEC Radio in Decorah and David Paxton with the Albia Monroe County News in Albia.
The first question will be from Darin.
SVENSON: Good morning, Senator. Yesterday, Senate Democrats introduced a plan regarding health care coverage. I believe the price tag is $774 billion, does not include a public option. Senator Baucus introduced it yesterday. According to reports, there's no Republicans that have stepped out and said they supported what is being called a bipartisan plan. What are your concerns with the plan that was released yesterday?
GRASSLEY: My concerns are that the process of arriving at a total package that was bipartisan was intervened by the White House and the majority leader, which ended up making it very partisan, even though a large part of it had been negotiated up to a point of being bipartisan.
But, you know, there are several outstanding issues that are just not resolved. And so, consequently, no Republican went on. And I do not hold Senator Baucus in any way responsible for that.
You know, when -- when most of this legislation is not going to take -- take effect for the year 2012, you know, what's another two or three weeks or a month to negotiate? In other words, we Republicans felt: Get it right. Senator Baucus also had that feeling -- get it right -- and just worked a long, long period of time to do that.
But then, when he's told, "You've got to move," he has to move. Well, he had to move in a partisan way.
And just to tell you the number of meetings that the group of six had, we had 31 meetings. And that's just since July the 7th. I've had 22 other member meetings and then 25 other meetings that I would categorize as -- as just other, because there are various varieties.
And, you know, speaking to my constituents since January, not even including my town meetings, but I had in this office in Washington, D.C., 134 meetings, just on health care issue.
So I think that -- that, you know, there's been some accusation out there that Republicans not being a part of this was then, in turn, political on our part. But do you think that we would have spent those hours and hours maybe running up to more than 100 hours trying to negotiate a bipartisan agreement if we weren't serious about it? So I kind of resent charges coming from the White House that maybe we were never serious.
PAXTON: Senator, I have kind of a follow-up question that'll kind of move into another question then. The president talked last week about paying for his health care plan by eliminating waste and fraud in Medicare. I think he used $400 billion or something like that.
And now the second part of this thing is a little bit different, but this -- this whole ACORN thing has come up with -- with just the incredible corruption that's going on there. First of all, what -- what kind of -- why isn't the corruption and -- and fraud being eliminated in Medicare now? And -- and what is the Senate and the House going to do about this -- this ACORN scandal?
GRASSLEY: Well, I'll tell you why fraud and abuse isn't being eliminated. It's because CMS, the agency, is a check-writing organization and a paying organization. They don't do enough to check.
Like, for instance, I can tell you, vendors tell me that one way to get rid of fraud within Medicare would be, don't send a check just to a post office box. In other words, there's got to be a place of business. And so a lot of times, post office box covers up somebody that's in the business to defraud government.
But let me suggest to you another thing that's ironic about that statement is. When -- when the government's totally running Medicare, and you have this sort of -- of waste, fraud and abuse, then to think about setting up another government program, doesn't it sound a little ironic that you complain about waste, fraud and abuse, and you can save $400 billion, and then in turn want to set up another government agency to do health care? Somewhat ironic.
PAXTON: Yes, it doesn't make any sense. What about the -- what's the Senate -- what action is going to be taken with these latest -- this ACORN stuff, which is just -- I think everybody can agree that this is unbelievable.
GRASSLEY: Well, it's finally reached the stage where probably the fifth or sixth vote this year, the previous four or five votes never got a majority to eliminate funding from a bill for ACORN. And -- and I don't know how many bills might provide funding for ACORN as a nonprofit organization, because there's -- a lot of money goes to nonprofit organizations, but hopefully not making the stupid things that ACORN does.
But, anyway, we finally got enough votes, by a vote of -- well, only seven senators voting to fund ACORN, the others voted not to. And that overwhelming vote shows public resentment against ACORN and also gives some credibility to journalistic investigations that have proved that things are -- are wrong there. People have suspected it for a long time, but there really wasn't evidence. There really wasn't evidence.
And then how -- we'll have another vote today that I'll bet will carry by the same margin on the interior appropriation bill to deny funds to ACORN.
SVENSON: Regarding the economy, Senator, Fed Chair Bernanke came out yesterday -- because of the ACORN story, this didn't get a lot of attention. But he made the statement, something to the effect of the worst of the recession is over. Are you seeing those signs as you talk to normal Americans, everyday Iowans?
GRASSLEY: Chuck Grassley or Dr. Bernanke aren't going to convince most Americans that the recession is over, even if it is officially over, and there's a nonprofit organization that makes that determination. And I'll accept their judgment.
But for -- most Americans will not accept it until unemployment goes way down. And unemployment is not the first factor that indicates a recession, so then, oddly enough, it's -- it's the last statistic to improve after you come out of a recession. And I think people are going to continue and measure and think we're in a recession as long as you have unemployment above 6 percent.
PAXTON: Senator, I'd like to shift a little bit. I think last week they -- they announced that Tom Harkin is stepping down as the head of the Senate Ag Committee and -- and Senator Lincoln from Arkansas is moving into that spot. I heard her interviewed on WHO, and it sounds like she's somewhat friendly to a lot of our fear over cap and trade, but she comes from a huge rice production -- I know that you don't particularly agree with some of her stands there. What -- how's that going to change the...
GRASSLEY: Well, really, the only difference between Senator Lincoln and me on agricultural issues is basically the cap on subsidies for farmers. I favor the $250,000 cap, and she says it's unfair to rice and cotton. I don't agree with her, but on most everything else, we agree, and I think she's going to be a good secretary of agriculture -- or, I mean, a good chairman of the Agriculture Committee, and be able to work with Secretary of Agriculture Vilsack the same way Senator Harkin did.
I think maybe for Midwestern agriculture it would be better if Senator Harkin had stayed there, but on the other hand, you've got to realize the very significance of the new position he's taken up, dealing with health issues, education issues, labor issues, and pension issues, and that's where the acronym for the committee HELP comes from -- H-E-L-P -- it's a pretty significant committee. And to have an Iowan chairman of that committee, we ought to applaud the move that he's making.
And -- and if -- if somebody from a city was taking over agriculture or somebody that was anti-agriculture, then I would say he shouldn't have made the move. But with Blanche Lincoln moving in there, then, you know, I have no fear that I'll be handled the same way that Senator Harkin would handle it, except Senator Harkin agreed with me on the $250,000 cap.
And so that's kind of just where I -- I leave it, because I think that she's a good person, a dedicated senator, dedicated to her state, and dedicated to agriculture generally.
STAFF: Thank you, Darin and David, for participating in today's public affairs program. This has been Senator Chuck Grassley reporting to the people of Iowa.
GRASSLEY: OK. Thank you both.
PAXTON: Thanks. Hang in there, Senator.
GRASSLEY: You bet.
PAXTON: All right.
END